Episode #032 How to Make Make-up work for You as a Midlife Woman with Guest Ali Oswald

Midlife Unlimited® is all about ripping off that mask and not putting on a brave face. But wearing make-up can seem the antithesis to that. 

And while we’re looking in the mirror and barely recognising the face staring back at us, the beauty industry and media bombard us with anti-aging propaganda and products promising to turn back the clock and give us that youthful glow.

At the same time we’re dubbed bold to wear red lipstick – and brave to go bare-faced.

If this resonates, join your host Kate Porter The Midlife Metamorphosis Coach® and her guest Make-Up Artist and Ambassador Ali Oswald for Episode 032 as they talk about How to Make Make-Up work for You as a Midlife Woman. 

Midlife make-up is a potential minefield, and if you’ve never worn it before it can feel daunting and uncomfortable – should you really start wearing it now?

Ali shares her expertise on how we Gen X-up women can wear make-up in a way that feels right to us – using it to enhance our features, rather than trying to turn back to the clock and replicate a style or look that no longer feels right for who we are now.

Kate and Ali shake up stereotypes about wearing make-up in our 40s, 50s and beyond – both being advocates that make-up is not frivolous vanity, it’s empowering and underpins how we present ourselves to the world both personally and in business. 

Ali explains how her relationship with make-up has played a huge part in her personal metamorphosis journey, firing her passion to help others enhance their natural beauty. 

From colour to contour, tune in too for Ali’s top tips for making make-up work for us now, and how to feel comfortable in our own skin by protecting it in our Second Spring and beyond. 

And Ali has unmissable advice for all you mums of teens to help them develop a skincare routine that’s right for them.

Connect with Ali

www.alioswald.co.uk

https://instagram.com/alioswaldmakeup 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/alioswald/

Transcript

SPEAKER_01: 0:01

Welcome to Midlife Unlimited, the podcast for women who want more. I'm your host, Kate Porter, the Midlife Metamorphosis Coach, and I know what it's like to feel stuck navigating the midlife maze. I've looked in the mirror and thought, who is that woman? So Midlife Unlimited is here to let you know you are not alone. You don't have to put on a brave face and put up with it. You don't have to play it safe. midlife unlimited is all about ripping off that mask and telling midlife how it really is nothing is off limits because together there's no limit to what we can achieve so welcome to today's episode now midlife unlimited like i just said is all about ripping off that mask and not putting on a brave face but But wearing makeup can seem the antithesis to that. And while we're looking in the mirror, barely recognising the woman staring back at us, the beauty industry and media bombards us with anti-ageing propaganda and products promising to turn back the clock and give us that youthful glow. And at the same time, we're dubbed bold to wear red lipstick, like me, or brave if we go barefoot. Well, it's time to call in the expert to help us navigate the midlife makeup minefield. So I'm delighted to be joined by my guest today, Ali Oswald, makeup artist and ambassador to talk about how to make makeup work for you as a midlife woman. So welcome, Ali. It's lovely to have you here.

SPEAKER_00: 1:55

Hi, Kate. I'm so pleased to be here. Thanks so much for inviting me.

SPEAKER_01: 1:59

Oh, my absolute pleasure. Because if there's one woman that's going to help us navigate this minefield, that is makeup. In midlife, it's you. Because we get, are we mutton dressed as lamb? If we're not used to wearing it, do we feel like a clown? I mean, you must work with women at all stages of their relationship with makeup. And it isn't easy, is it?

SPEAKER_00: 2:24

Absolutely and I think when people do get to midlife they can lose their way a little bit and we can get a bit you know just unsure about what suits us and whether we should still do things that we've been doing for the last 20 years or whether we should change it and yeah I love working with those ladies and seeing how much more confident they feel afterwards.

SPEAKER_01: 2:48

Well I say I've I've very much experienced it as part of my own metamorphosis, both mentally and style wise, because obviously for those that haven't seen a photo of me, I'm embracing the grey. My skin tone has changed quite dramatically, really. And so it is about rethinking, like you said, you know, what works in your 30s and your 40s. And I think we can get into a, not a rut, but we tend to do makeup in the same way. And I think midlife is a good time to to actually stop and think, is this still working? Are we... Because it's not frivolous, I think. And I wear it for me. I don't wear it for anyone else. I don't know about you, Ali.

SPEAKER_00: 3:29

Yeah, no, I just love wearing it. And it's not... I used to wear it as a mask when I was in my... you know, growing up in my teens to my up to my mid 30s. And then, but now I wear it because I just love it. And it's part of my personality. And it does make me feel more confident, a bit more put together. So even though we can't see each other on this podcast, I've still put my face on because it makes me feel confident to do something like this. I'm exactly with you because, well, I

SPEAKER_01: 4:01

have

SPEAKER_00: 4:01

as

SPEAKER_01: 4:01

well, probably not as well as you have, but yours will have to get you over. But it makes me feel dressed. Yeah. It's not war paint. It just makes me feel right. I've got my lipstick on. I've got my perfume on. I've got my mascara on. Right. Kate's ready now.

SPEAKER_00: 4:15

Absolutely. Yeah. And you don't have to wear a lot to feel like that. You know, I think people think when you put makeup on, they've got to do the whole face. But actually, it's just, well, especially when you get to midlife, it's more about the framing, I think, for me. And I know we're going to talk a bit more about that later.

SPEAKER_01: 4:35

Oh, you've preempted me perfectly there. I do like a segue. Yeah, absolutely, listeners. Because later on, I'm delighted that Ali is going to be sharing her top tips for making makeup. It's kind of how I'm saying this. I'm quite impressed with myself. Making makeup work for you as a midlife woman. And you don't want to miss those. So stay tuned. But firstly, we were just talking about shifting how we... Well, it's not vanity, but how we see ourselves. And that's such a big thing at this time, isn't it? It's just looking in that mirror and thinking, who are you really inside and out? But it would be lovely if you could share because it is quite a journey you've been on both. with makeup, with skin. And I know you're not just about makeup. You're about the whole routine, about skin care, about how we basically feel our best. And that doesn't mean we have to be plastering on the foundation. But take us back, if you don't mind, to how your relationship, your love affair really with makeup began. Because I think that is a fair, it did become a love affair once you actually had this epiphany moment.

SPEAKER_00: 5:46

Absolutely. And my first experience, I guess, with makeup for myself was more about covering up because I'd struggled with my skin from teenage years. And obviously at school and back in the day, we weren't allowed to wear makeup. So I used to get teased quite a bit about my skin because I couldn't cover it up. And so, you know, over the years, your self-esteem gets knocked down quite a bit, doesn't it? My School friends of primary school friends used to say I used to put makeup on them all the time, apparently when I was little. So it's, you know, it's something that started from an early age. But then I went through that period of using it to cover up so that I didn't get the pointing and the comments and the things from people. And it just gave me that boost of confidence. So I'd always say I've got to put my mask on before I go out. um and yeah it just meant I could I felt more confident when I was doing you know going to work or just even just chatting to anybody but um I got into my mid-30s and we moved to New Zealand so my husband's from New Zealand and we went over there and at this point makeup was just for me I wasn't doing it as a job for anybody I was actually a hairdresser I was going to say

SPEAKER_01: 7:12

you well anyone if you could see us now yeah Ali you always look immaculate and I just love your we'll have to do hair another time I think yeah

SPEAKER_00: 7:22

so yeah I'd grown up you know from school I trained to be a hairdresser and makeup like I say was was just for me really it was my armor I guess to cope to to cope with, you know, different things, not just my skin, but went through a lot with my hubby when we first got together. And like I say, it just helped me with that confidence boost. But when we went to live in New Zealand, I met a lovely lady in a coffee shop and I overheard her chatting to somebody else about foundation. And I used to wear...

SPEAKER_01: 7:59

Didn't you think she was talking, sorry to interrupt, but I remember this really, this really... hit me. Your first thought was they were talking about you.

SPEAKER_00: 8:08

Yeah because I was so used to people talking about me pointing and generally just not being that nice and yeah when I was queuing up for my cup of tea I overheard them talking about foundation and it was so hot in New Zealand when we went because it was around Christmas time when we got there and because I wore such a lot of makeup by sort of lunch time it was on all on my you know it was getting on my clothes because it was just melting off my face and so I was pretty mortified thinking they were talking about that and um but then I quickly realized that one was giving the other advice about her foundation so um I just sort of earwigged for a little bit and then I went over to this lady and said you know sorry to butt in but it sounds like I need your help too um can you help me with my skin you can see I'm having problems and she gave me a card and that was like the first thing I did when I got home from work was give her a call and she came round to my house. I actually got my two sister-in-laws round because I didn't know this woman and she was just turning up at my house, stranger, but rarely had anybody seen me without makeup so that was nerve-wracking in itself that I was going to have to take my I didn't have to, but obviously to try her foundation, I needed to take all mine off. And so my sister-in-laws, I gave them plenty of wine to start with, just because they'd always seen me with my makeup on. And anyway, we put the foundation on and I loved it. And I hadn't actually, before I'd even seen it, I thought, God, I can't feel anything on my face. This isn't going to have covered anything.

UNKNOWN: 9:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 9:57

and so I was so used to feeling like I'd got a mask on and when I looked in the mirror I was like oh wow you know that's actually covered it up I can't feel anything on my face so that was my first experience with being helped I guess with with my skin and my makeup because yes she helped me with my foundation but then obviously she helped she offered her help for my skin and To start with, I was just like, no, I've tried everything. I've spent a fortune. I've been to so many different places to get help for my skin. And I didn't want to go on racotene or anything like that because I'd had other health issues with having kids and stuff. And the side effects were similar and I didn't want to go back to that place. So that's why I used to just cover it up and just think, I've just got to live with it because this is how it is. But she offered her help. And the only reason I gave it a go was she said, I'll get my money back if it didn't work. And she was so lovely. And it was the whole, I had a whole consultation with her. And again, whenever I'd gone into a shop, they'd just seen my bad skin and just thought, oh. I'm going to get my sales today because she needs everything. But there's no follow-up. There was no care or anything after the appointment. But with Claire, she was amazing. And she made sure that I'd got a routine that I was going to stick with because it had to be quick. It had to be simple. I'd got two small children at the time, so I wasn't going to faff about. And she listened to that. She just sold me two things to start with, not a whole range that I wasn't going to stick with. And then we built it up once I got used to doing that and I was willing to take that next step. And that was the only reason I gave it a go was because she said, I'll get a refund if it didn't work. And I thought, well, I might as well give it a go. And she did what she said and she kept in touch with me. She made sure that it was... what was happening with my skin and she made some tweaks if necessary. And I thought, oh my God, this is not anything that I'd experienced before. And after three months, I hadn't got any spots on my face and I hadn't had that since before teens. So to suddenly have a clear face and I used to have big lumps, not just the odd pimple. It was... you know, painful lumps on my face and all the other little ones in between. It had all gone. And it was by chatting to me in the consultation, she found, you know, there was two or three key areas where I just had to make a tweak to make my routine work better. But equally, obviously, it was, you know, she was finding out what I was doing and she was then giving me an alternative sort of routine to try. But she kept in touch to make sure it was working for me. And then, like I say, after three months, my skin had cleared up. Obviously, I still had lots of scarring from previous spots, but even that's gone over the years by using a microdermabrasion that I could do myself at home. So I did that twice a week once the spots had gone. And So yeah, the scarring's gone as well. So I was just like, you know, the whole experience for me was life-changing. But it actually took me a while to feel confident to go out with so little makeup on, even though I had no spots, because I was so used to that mask. I felt a bit naked, I'll be honest. And I was like, oh God, it felt like, I was so used to people looking at me for the wrong reasons. It was really hard to get used to that transition of people not looking at me because I'd got a face full of spots. And I just felt quite exposed for a while. But yeah, obviously I got used to that and I was very excited about having clear skin and then I was just telling everyone about this product and that's what got me into doing it myself because I just wanted to help other people like she helped me basically and we're still friends and I think

SPEAKER_01: 14:44

that's beautiful I love the fact that you're still

SPEAKER_00: 14:47

yeah Well, this is 20 years on and she's in New Zealand and I'm over here, obviously. But we're still friends and we connect when I go over there. And I'm not sure quite how much she realizes she's... I know change my life sounds dramatic, but for me, it was such a game changer with how I felt about myself and... that I could just feel like me without putting that mask on. But, of course, these days, you know, we've got the added pressure of social media. And so, you know, there's an expectation now, isn't there, to look good a lot of, you know, most of the time. But, yeah, I like passing on what I learned from Claire all those years ago to other people so they don't have to go through what I did, really. So...

SPEAKER_01: 15:41

That's

SPEAKER_00: 15:41

why I work with a lot of women and their teenagers.

SPEAKER_01: 15:45

No, absolutely. I'd like to talk about teenagers and our daughters as well. I mean, I've only got a boy, but honorary daughters in a minute. But one thing that definitely strikes me about what you do, and it's something that as businesswomen... all the time, visibility, the big V word, and going on camera, not just static, but in terms of doing videos, going live, which we're going to be doing to promote this episode. I mean, I'm guessing you've got women all the time saying, you know, I don't really wear makeup, but even just to look better on camera. Yeah. Like, you know, you see, you know, even the chaps on TV wear some makeup too. So I'm guessing it is something that you would recommend even if you don't normally wear makeup of any sort again we're going to go into your top tips in a bit but would you say yes do look into absolutely yeah and i think

SPEAKER_00: 16:43

yeah i think that came to the forefront even more through covid times because obviously we were doing a lot more online meetings and online networking and particularly for the um you know solopreneurs and things like that they're going to networking meetings you want to stand out on that screen of many faces so if you're there with you know no makeup on or anything you're going to fade into the background um and again it's not vanity it's about showing up being visible and getting people to notice that you're there and think oh I can see Kate over there. I'd like to have a chat with her. You can't

SPEAKER_01: 17:24

normally miss me.

SPEAKER_00: 17:26

But it might be, you know, she's always got a lovely bright lipstick on and so that would catch people's eye on the screen. So I always said to people, even if you don't normally wear makeup, always have a brighter lipstick next to your computer, even if that's the only time you wear it, wear it on screen. But like you say, Now we're getting told to show up more on social media platforms and things like that. That's when we start questioning what we look like again, isn't it? And for me, it's about enhancing your natural features, not trying to make you look like somebody else. And I would never have... any Botox or anything like that. I've got nothing against it for other people. Frankly, it would frighten me that it would go wrong.

SPEAKER_01: 18:24

and I've heard so many I don't know if horror stories is the right word but like my son's girlfriend was talking about it the other day because as I understand it I mean the youngsters are having baby Botox and things like that but she was talking about it shifting like fillers that move to parts of your face that they're not meant to be and I'm like oh my goodness knowing me I'd end up I'd have it for laughter lines and it would end up on my chin or something like that and I'm like no I

SPEAKER_00: 18:53

know that's what freaks me out so I think well I'd rather do my makeup in a way that it draws attention away from any lines and things like that and which is what I used to do when I had spots to be fair so I used to play you know make my eyes really stand out to try and make people look at my eyes rather than my skin or a bold lipstick or something like that and I think that's where my you know where I used to love wearing bold lippies and things like that because i was just trying to draw people's attention away from what i didn't want them to look at

SPEAKER_01: 19:27

it's an optical illusion of sorts isn't it as well and i think very much i mean i'm all about and i know you are as well you know each wrinkle we've earned it's got a little story behind it but again when it comes to makeup in midlife and moving forward it's almost less can be more because the more we're tempted to pile on and the more it will sit. I mean, I don't know all the technicalities, but I'm guessing I know if that feeling of being caked. Yeah, absolutely. You do smile. The kind of the smile lines are exacerbated by this thick makeup layer that just kind of like looks toffee or something. Especially if you kind of go down the fake tanny type beige. Yeah. So these, are all things that are leading up to your top tips but before there's one word that you've already used and obviously we mentioned a legacy and I know you've done amazing things like London Fashion Week and obviously you've got your own makeup academy but you really are creating a legacy and it's something I know you you have daughter a daughter yourself yeah and you're very passionate about And I won't say teaching them because they pick up information left, right and centre, don't they? I know it's TikTok this, TikTok that. They are bombarded probably as much as we are, if not more so. If not more, yeah. And it's blinking scary that misinformation can be causing issues with their beautiful skin at such an early age, can't it? They can be almost... How do we help them? How do we help our girls?

SPEAKER_00: 21:12

I think, well, particularly with... I've got two girls and a boy. Of

SPEAKER_01: 21:17

course. I knew you had three. I couldn't remember which way round it was.

SPEAKER_00: 21:22

Yeah. So I've got girl, boy, girl. And they've... all sort of had to navigate problem skin a bit. They probably inherited that from me along the way, but obviously I was ready for it. And as soon as I could sort of see that starting to happen, we were straight into getting a simple routine in place. And I think that's the key is because I see quite a frequently they are doing so much to their skin already. I had one young girl here and I asked them to bring everything that they're doing and she was using four toners but she didn't realize because one's called a toner, one's called a freshener, one's called a skin tonic and because they all said something different she thought they were doing different things for her face but actually I think they're all doing the same thing. So her skin was just overworked overstimulated and the more spots she got then the more she was doing to it so it was really great to go through with her actually you only need one of those so use one up and then go on to the next one and it's cleanse tone moisturize try and keep it as simple as possible and when they you know start getting older that's when you can start introducing other things but as a teenager, they just don't need it. And also it comes down to, you know, how much sugar are you eating? How much, you know, fizzy drinks are they having chocolate? And for me with, with my skin, um, I found out I was intolerant to dairy as well. So I, I talked to people about obviously those things as well. It's because it goes hand in hand, doesn't it with skincare and how much water you drink and all that sort of thing. So, um, Yeah, if someone comes to me with quite bad skin, then I talk to them about sugar and dairy. How much of each do you use? And maybe just try and cut it down a little bit. I'm not saying you can't have any sweets or anything again, but cut it down and just notice if there's a difference. And do one thing at a time so that we know, obviously, which one it is.

SPEAKER_01: 23:42

Yeah, that's a good way, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00: 23:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 23:45

I'm trying to think of the right word then. But yeah, isolating, saying, oh, how does this work? How does it?

SPEAKER_00: 23:50

Yeah. And that's actually why starting a routine really simply is if anything flares up or makes it worse, you've only got those minimal products to tweak. If you give someone too many things, it's like, well, which one's causing the problem? We don't know.

SPEAKER_01: 24:07

That's great advice.

SPEAKER_00: 24:10

Yeah. Starting anything off small is better because you can always add If you need to. So the same with makeup. If people come to me and they're like, I'd like to start wearing a bit of makeup, but I don't wear much. Where do I start? So for me, it's getting the skin right first, because otherwise the makeup doesn't look great. And depending on what the skin is like to how much coverage they need. And that's another conversation with the foundation side. Yeah. But when you're getting to the midlife, it's for me, it's a hydration because we need more of that. And that's not just drinking it, but foundations, you know, you might need to change it to a luminous one rather than a matte one. If you're used to wearing that or if you're used to wearing a powder, then you might need to go to a like a CC cream or something. Yeah. And now I'm aware that I'm sort of going into my tips and we might not be there yet.

SPEAKER_01: 25:11

No, I must admit, I used to, especially in my 20s and 30s, I used to love translucent powder. Absolutely adore it. But now I find in terms of actual foundation, I'm using less and less. I'm using it more as a kind of a little touch. I'm asking for a little one-to-one here. And it's no good to you listeners because you can't see us. We can see each other. And I'm like, well, this bit here. Yeah. Shall we step back from my own personal dilemmas with how to slap on the slap? And we'll go into the first of your top tips. And I love this because it makes us think we are works of art. We really are us midlife women. And framing works. Framing these gorgeous faces that tell our stories. Yeah. How do we go about doing that? And why? Why do we need framing?

SPEAKER_00: 26:15

Well, the framing, I think, has come... You know, obviously, I am that middle-aged woman now. And it's... So, for me, it's enhancing my eyebrows, my lashes, my cheeks and my lips. Because as we get older... Lashes get a bit sparser. I've always had really thick eyebrows and I've had to wax them in half most of my life. And now they're starting to get a bit sparse. So I'm having to fill in the gaps, which I've never had to do before. I'm

SPEAKER_01: 26:46

starting to get the... the long white hair that wasn't there two days ago and now is at least three inches long. But I worry that if I pluck it, A, I can't see without my glasses on and B, I wonder I'm going to do it too vigorously and end up with like a ball patch like the boxers do, you know, like...

SPEAKER_02: 27:05

How many

SPEAKER_01: 27:06

have you got? I don't know. Oh, I get one on my top lip that I call my little friend because it suddenly appears. And again, they're never just a little sharp thing. It's suddenly like an inch long. Anyway, back to framing. Yeah, so my eyebrows, I never know what to do with the white ones.

SPEAKER_00: 27:26

Well, I would pluck it out, depending on how many there are. But equally, you can... you know, tint your eyebrows because as we get older, the color goes, they get, you know, like you say, you can get gray ones, white ones, and it doesn't then frame your eyes. So you feel like you're sort of disappearing as such as you're getting older because your eyebrows, your eyelashes, your lip line, you think your lips have gone all thin, but actually the line is still there, but it's just not as dark as it was when you were younger. So yeah, enhancing those areas will make a huge difference without you feeling like you're wearing a lot of makeup either. So to make sure the shape and the color of your eyebrows is there, um, will make you look like you've got eye makeup on, even if you've just done your eyebrows and especially if you're wearing glasses and you, both you and I've got dark frame glasses. So you do want to make sure that your eyebrows are there. Um, I think some people make the mistake of, well, I've got glasses on, so you can't see them anyway. But you can see them enough to make a difference for the framing of your eyes. So that was my first thing is make sure your eyebrows are there and the right color. And wearing mascara. So It's getting the right mascara because there's so many different types, isn't there? If you've got really spindly lashes, you just want one that's going to gently coat them and make them feel a bit thicker. So don't go for a too heavy, consistent mascara. Something a bit lighter. Again, just to enhance them a bit. Oh, that's interesting

SPEAKER_01: 29:09

because mine are quite sparse. And I always go for like the, oh, the biggest, volume-y. And then I end up with like kind of spidery clumps.

SPEAKER_00: 29:19

Yeah. Because if you've got sparser lashes, it's just going to clump each one of them and make them look too thick. Or you could have them tinted as well. I keep being tempted to try the fake ones. Yeah, but I've had fake ones. It just irritates my eyes, to be honest. Because my eyes, I wear glasses most of the time now. Well, that's what I do. Instead of lenses, because my eyes have got so sensitive lenses. So yeah, so choosing the right mascara and then enhancing your cheekbones and then putting a lip liner on. I never used to wear lip liner. I don't. Yeah, I do now. So it just enhances those lips, makes them look just a bit more polished, I guess. And like I say, if you do the eyebrows, lashes, cheeks and lips, then if you don't want to wear any more, then that's fine because it will look like you've done a lot, whereas actually you've done a little bit. And that's like a nice five-minute makeup.

SPEAKER_01: 30:35

That's brilliant because that brings us on to routine. And as you said, it's not about spending. I mean, you might want to spend hours getting ready. You might actually enjoy it. That's great. That's your thing. That's one of, you know, but... Most of us that just think, right, five minutes, part of our morning, evening routine. How important is that to actually establish our routine? Whether it's putting on the makeup and taking it off again, because I know that's something that I may be not always that good at. But you had a top tip for that as well, didn't you?

SPEAKER_00: 31:12

Well, taking it off is really important. I have been

SPEAKER_01: 31:17

known.

SPEAKER_00: 31:18

Even more important, I think, to... do your skincare routine at nighttime. And it's just about getting used to knowing when to do it. So a lot of people just say, oh, I'm too tired at night. By the time I go to bed, I can't be bothered. So when I wasn't in a regular routine, when my kids were small, when I was trying to sort my skin out and everything, I thought, you know what? I spend so much time in here when they're having a bath that I'm going to do it then. So while the kids are in the bath, obviously I've got to be in the room with them, but they don't need me to play as such. I'm just going to take my face off then, obviously if I'm not going out anyway. So that's when I would do my skincare routine because it was about, I don't know, six o'clock or something. They're having a bath and I can do my face and still keep an eye on them at the same time. So it's finding when... is good for you so if you come in from work at the end of the day you're not going anywhere you generally we go and get changed don't we from our work clothes to something more comfy do it then so it's all done and dusted ready for you to go to bed because your skin renews and repairs itself when you're asleep so if you go to bed with makeup on eye makeup or face makeup then your skin's got to work a lot harder to renew and repair itself. And it's not going to do such a good job. And I've been told that every time you don't do your face at nighttime, it adds eight days to the age of your skin.

SPEAKER_01: 32:52

Oh dear. Right. Tonight's the night, as they say.

SPEAKER_00: 32:58

And with eye makeup as well, you know, you can get just eye infections and, and lash mites and all that sort of stuff. So, yeah. Yeah. It's good to do it. It's just finding when is the best time for you to do it. And always make sure you use a separate eye makeup remover to face cleanser. Oh, why is that? Because even if a product says it's gentle enough for your eyes and your face as an all in one, if it's gentle enough for your eyes, it's not doing enough for your face, the skin on your face.

SPEAKER_01: 33:34

Well, do you know, I did think that.

SPEAKER_00: 33:38

Yeah, because the skin around your eyes obviously is a lot thinner and a lot more delicate. So you need a separate product, whatever brand it is, use a separate cleanser to eye makeup remover. Because if you use something that's strong enough for your face on your eyes, then it's going to be too strong for the eyes and you might get puffy. You're going to cause more fine lines and wrinkles and, you know, probably stinging. So yeah, use separate ones. So that's my other tip that I thought about. No,

SPEAKER_01: 34:08

that's because it's definitely stinging that, because the skin is so sensitive, isn't it, around our eyes? And I've used things that were, I mean, I won't mention what they were, but yeah, they were meant to be really gentle. And that, I didn't get it actually in my eye, but you could feel almost like a smarting of the skin. Yeah. Yeah. And we don't want that. No. We

SPEAKER_00: 34:30

don't want that. And when you take your eye makeup off, always hold the product on your eye for a few seconds first to let it melt your mascara and anything. That is something I

SPEAKER_01: 34:42

do because my eyelashes are so sparse that I worry that if I do any sort of dragging motion, I'm going to end up with nothing at all. I'm going to just

SPEAKER_00: 34:51

pull them all out. But equally, you don't want to be rubbing and scrubbing and pulling the skin around your eyes either because, again, that's going to... You know, it starts to not ping back like it used to.

SPEAKER_01: 35:00

As with other areas of our bodies as well. But your third tip, which I think, however you wear makeup or not, whatever works for you, it's all about, as with most things in midlife when we can, having fun with it, isn't it? Because there are no real rules apart from guidelines, like you said, about the use of framing and rethinking our routine that we've had for the past decades, really. Yeah. Personality shining through. I like the sound of that.

SPEAKER_00: 35:41

Absolutely. And I think, you know, it's not one size fits all. um obviously I I give advice on what colors are good for you and what suits you and all that sort of thing and what um techniques are good for your eye shapes and all of that but equally it comes down to personality so if I said to you you shouldn't wear red lippy I'm not saying that because it looks great but if I if I said that you'd be like oh well that you know that's me that's but I don't feel right without it. And the same with me. I don't feel right without a hot pink lipstick most days. So if you take that away, you're taking that personality away from that person. So it's also having the personality in your makeup as well as where you should and shouldn't put it really. Because that person's going to, still feel great in their own skin, and that's what you want them to do. You don't want them to try to be looking like somebody else, or this is what you should look like at this age, or they still want to feel like them. No,

SPEAKER_01: 36:49

absolutely. And I said we have all the kind of the trends. I mean, I'm a big thing about nail varnish. I do think nail varnish is a fun way to experiment a bit, even if you're not up to going... smoky eyes or yeah oh i think we can especially this time of year you know we're coming into the lovely summer weather it's my birthday i'm pretty sure i think it's yes i think it's my birthday the week we're coming out so uh yes we are having the sun no it always rains on my birthday

SPEAKER_00: 37:21

oh no it's not this year it's gonna be lovely

SPEAKER_01: 37:24

Yeah, absolutely. But no, there are, you know, or even like in the summertime as well, I love the kind of bronzer blushes that have got a little bit of sparkle as well. Not too much that we look like a Christmas tree, but...

SPEAKER_00: 37:37

Yeah. I think, well, when we've got a little bit of a tan, we don't feel like we need so much makeup then, do we? So it is about highlighting and bronzing and just, yeah, bringing that little bit of sheen out. And I've started putting some... nourishing oil drops in my foundation just to give that little bit of a glow on my skin as well. Oh, how do we do that? So I just put my foundation on the back of my hand and I've just put some little couple of little drops of oil in it so that I get more of a sheen on my face. Not so it

SPEAKER_01: 38:13

looks... No, it's gorgeous. It's a real like, oh,

SPEAKER_00: 38:17

yeah. Not so it looks like an oil slick because it doesn't feel... You know, I can go like that and it's not on my hands or anything. But it just gives you that sheen and extra hydration. So I'm finding that my skin, as I'm getting older, is just drying out. And I've never had dry skin in my life. I've always had the oily, spotty skin. But now, in the old menopause, my skin is loads more dry. But I'm finding putting those couple of drops of oil in is making it look... Less dry and nice. And what kind of oil could it be? So the one I use is an almond nourishing oil. It's a Mary Kay product that I use. And I can use it in my hair. I can use it on my elbows, my knees. I can put it in my foundation. I put it on top of my night cream. It smells

SPEAKER_01: 39:14

nice as well. I bet

SPEAKER_00: 39:15

it smells good. It smells amazing. Yeah. Even my husband. My husband says, oh, can you smell nice? What have you got on? And I say, oh, I've just got my oil on.

SPEAKER_01: 39:25

No. It just makes you feel even more. Yeah. Doesn't it?

SPEAKER_00: 39:30

And you only need those couple of drops and it goes a long way. So, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 39:35

My other question to you, obviously, makeup artist extraordinaire. And I say London Fashion Week, obviously events. You've got your Academy Awards. I picture you with this kind of stainless steel trundle in terms of when you turn up at events. Yeah. But Ali, when Ali's making up, how big is the bag?

SPEAKER_00: 40:00

My bag's probably not much bigger than my phone, to be honest.

SPEAKER_01: 40:06

Really?

SPEAKER_00: 40:06

Yeah. But

SPEAKER_01: 40:07

that shows then, you're all about streamlining then. You know exactly what does what.

SPEAKER_00: 40:12

Yeah. You know, and occasionally I might change the color of my eyeshadows or something, but I've got a palette that fits a daytime and a nighttime eye colors in it. It's got my blusher. It's got my contour. It's got my highlighter. So it's got that all in one palette that I can mix and match. And then a bit of eyeliner, my eyebrow pencil, mascara, lippy. Good to go. Foundation. That's it.

SPEAKER_01: 40:42

Because I know another thing that I might, I don't like the word guilty, but I might have a spare makeup bag in the bathroom that I almost dread opening because I think it's got mascaras in there that must be almost as old as my son. Is it time for me to get rid of them?

SPEAKER_00: 41:01

Yeah, I probably wouldn't advise using that. They do

SPEAKER_01: 41:03

have a shelf, in all seriousness, though. I think we do need to keep brushes clean, don't we?

SPEAKER_00: 41:09

Yeah, definitely. Yeah. yeah brushes um I probably wash my foundation brush once a fortnight um and my eye makeup brushes I just do when I do my clients brushes and obviously I wash them after each lady but my own personal ones I'll do them every yeah couple of weeks I'd say because you know with eye infections and all that sort of stuff I don't want any of those um and it's It doesn't go on so nice if you don't keep your brushes nice and clean. So you'll notice a difference on how it goes on if you've got nice, clean brushes. But, you know, it doesn't take long. I just use a bit of fairy liquid.

SPEAKER_01: 41:51

Yeah, and an artist cleans their paintbrushes. And this is, we're creating a work of art, aren't we? I love that. And in a minute, you know what's coming next, but in a minute we will be sharing your... contact details because I say I've mentioned your academy and you can talk us through how the wonderful ladies listening can work with you how they can get your advice get your help they could be trained by you as well but first we're going to go into your three questions that I ask every one of my fabulous female guests on midlife unlimited so i'm afraid you can't escape the spotlight is being turned on you so my first question is what is your midlife anthem the piece of music or song or sound that lights you up that gets you punching the air and saying today's gonna be a good day

SPEAKER_00: 42:50

so i love a bit of queen that's my sort of music genre if you like and I love his song Don't Stop Me Now

SPEAKER_01: 43:01

oh yes

SPEAKER_00: 43:01

and I turn that up in the car when I'm going you know to meetings and stuff like that and yeah that's what gets me going and

SPEAKER_01: 43:12

good choice

SPEAKER_00: 43:13

gets me feeling good in the mornings

SPEAKER_01: 43:16

good choice I can just I can see you driving a convertible down the American highway with that blasting out Second question, then. We know what your anthem is. What is your midlife mantra, the phrase that you live your midlife by?

SPEAKER_00: 43:33

I've written down, follow your own path, because it's easy to look at other people, isn't it? Seeing what they do and thinking, should I be doing that or shouldn't I be doing that? And they're better than me and whatever. I'm not good enough and all of those voices that we hear in their head. So, yeah, follow your own path. Put your blinkers on. And we're all on our own journey. We're all at different points in our journey. And so focus on where you're going.

SPEAKER_01: 44:05

Oh, I love that. I'm 100%. I mean, I make it very clear how I feel about shoulds. But no, focus on and enjoy every step. Yeah. Because the destination might change. To me, it's all about enjoying yourself. the getting there as well

SPEAKER_00: 44:22

yeah if

SPEAKER_01: 44:23

not more so

SPEAKER_00: 44:24

absolutely and celebrate along the way celebrate the wins along the way

SPEAKER_01: 44:28

well talking of celebrating i do love a segue what would third question be the title of your autobiography have you decided is it a work in progress like the journey it is because i have actually started a book oh exciting you heard it here first listeners or maybe someone else knew someone tuning in knew this

SPEAKER_00: 44:54

um i'm not i'm not totally sure on the um title but there will be resilience in there somewhere um so i haven't finalized the title yet um because it's still a work in progress but yeah definitely it's about resilience

SPEAKER_01: 45:12

And we're all works in progress. I like that. I look forward to reading it. I look forward to reading it. Now, we mentioned earlier, obviously, there are a plethora of ways that fabulous ladies listening, and men if they want to as well, can work with you. So obviously, all your details, contact details will be in the show or are in the show notes for this episode. And you have your guest profile on the Midlife Unlimited podcast website. But if you could verbally talk us through just some of the things you offer and how listeners can get in touch with you

SPEAKER_00: 45:47

yeah so I do one-to-one makeup lessons or small group makeup lessons so I can go to people wherever they are or I can do online or I have a studio at home all set up ready to go up to four lovely ladies and I also do photo shoots so if you need help shots or anything done for your business then i um do hair and makeup for those with some lovely photographers um and as you mentioned earlier i've got my academy now so i set that up to be able to where a friend of mine gave me a kick up the bum and said you should be sharing all of this well not should like i say i don't like that word um it would be great if you shared your knowledge with everybody else, you know, so that they can also either start a new career or alongside something else as a makeup artist. So my online academy is a course that people can work through at their own pace, learn how to do their own makeup as well as other people's and start their own career as a makeup artist if they'd like to. And even though it's online, they do get a lot of... time with me as well, either online or face-to-face. I have people bringing models here and getting some hands-on training here as well. So, again, that's going to be something that will grow as well as time goes on. I'll keep adding things to that. And you can find out all of this through my website, which is www.allyoswald.co.uk. And I'm on all platforms of social media, but I guess my main one is Ali Oswald Makeup on Instagram. And I'm trying to show up more on there and be visible. But even though I do what I do, it's when just pressing that record button, I go. hesitate quite often

SPEAKER_01: 47:59

oh it's difficult isn't it it is tricky I say I am the queen of taking perfect perfectly imperfect action I am one take go for it I've been known to use the wrong word. And I literally do it like in the comments. I'll say, if you did notice, I might have said the wrong word

SPEAKER_00: 48:17

here. Yeah. But it's

SPEAKER_01: 48:18

there. It's out.

SPEAKER_00: 48:19

Yeah. The other day I tried to go live on Instagram and I'd never done it before. And then I couldn't work out how to turn it off. I was live and I was just like, God, I was going like this all around the screen. A day in the

SPEAKER_01: 48:34

life of Ali Oswald.

SPEAKER_00: 48:36

Live streamed

SPEAKER_01: 48:37

onto... No, I've not managed to... Yeah, no, I've

SPEAKER_00: 48:41

not... I should probably learn how to do it before I try and do it. That would have been better.

SPEAKER_01: 48:48

Well, it's been an absolute joy. I knew it would be. And listeners, I'd love your feedback on today's episode. So it'd be fabulous if you'd leave a review or you can email me or text me via the link in the show notes. And you can come and join the Midlife Unlimited podcast Facebook group. Again, the links in the show notes where you'll find the website link to with details of my exclusive VIP Midlife metamorphosis coaching offers. So thank you for joining me, Ali. It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you for having me. Oh, fabulous. Thank you for listening. And I look forward to you tuning in next week. Don't forget Midlife Unlimited has a new episode every Thursday available wherever you listen to your podcasts. So here's to being fabulous and flourishing together and living Midlife Unlimited. Thanks, Ali, ever so much. You've been a joy.

SPEAKER_00: 49:48

Thank you.

UNKNOWN: 49:50

Bye.