Episode #041 How to Turn Your Expertise into a Bestselling Book with Guest Helen O'Neill

Do you have a hankering to write a book? To share your knowledge? To widen the reach of your brilliance? Your host Kate Porter does.

And with so many Midlife Unlimited® guests climbing the best-seller charts – and one of Kate’s weekly guest questions being What is the title of your autobiography? – she’s donning her queen of taking perfectly imperfect action crown and going for it too.

As a former newspaper editor, Kate still regularly writes editorial copy. But when it comes to publishing a book, it’s a new territory that she’s rather nervouscited to explore.

So Kate’s calling in the expert… and if you’re ready to embark on your next chapter with her then this episode is just for you!

Join your host Kate The Midlife Metamorphosis Coach® and her guest Portfolio Career Specialist, Author and Founder of Coach Write Helen O’Neill for Episode 041 as they talk about How to Turn Your Expertise into a Best-selling Book.

Kate and Helen debate the adage that we all have a book in us, exploring the reasons why we may choose to write a book. And they give advice on ditching the “shoulds”, avoiding encroaching imposter syndrome and overcoming the fear that no-one will want to read our words of wisdom.

Author Helen shares how her passion for writing stems from childhood, and how COVID threatened to quash her creativity. And talks openly about her metamorphosis journey to not just reigniting her own purpose to share her expertise through the books she writes, but to also help others go for it too.

Tune in for top tips on how to start your journey to becoming a published author as Helen and Kate dig deep into how to turn our book dreams into reality. 

From the positives and potential pitfalls of using AI, via getting a publisher versus self-publishing, to overcoming writers’ block, if writing a book is on your Ta-Dah list – press play now! 

Connect with Helen

https://www.helenoneillcoaching.com

https://www.coachwrite.co.uk

https://mybook.to/pivot

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:01

Welcome to Midlife Unlimited, the podcast for Gen X women who want more. I'm your host, Kate Porter, the midlife metamorphosis coach, and I know what it's like to feel stuck navigating the midlife maze. I've looked in the mirror and thought, who is that woman? So Midlife Unlimited is here to let you know you are not alone. You don't have to put on a brave face and put up with it. You don't have to play it safe. Midlife Unlimited is all about ripping off that mask and telling midlife like it really is. Nothing is off limits because together there's no limit to what we can achieve. So welcome to today's episode. Now, do you have a hankering to write a book, to share your knowledge, to widen the reach of your brilliance? I do. And with so many of my Midlife Unlimited guests climbing the bestseller charts and one of my weekly questions being, what's the title of your autobiography? I'm donning my queen of taking perfectly imperfect action crown and going for it. Now, As a former newspaper editor, I still regularly write editorial copy, but when it comes to publishing a book, it's a new territory that I'm rather nervous-sighted about exploring. So I'm calling in the expert. And if you're ready to embark on your next chapter with me, then this episode is just for you. Because I'm delighted to be joined by my guest today, Helen O'Neill, portfolio career specialist, author and founder of CoachWrite, to talk about how to turn your expertise into a bestselling book. So welcome, Helen. It's fabulous to have you here.

SPEAKER_01: 1:57

Thanks, Kate. It's really good to be here.

SPEAKER_00: 2:00

Now, there is that old saying, and I think I will fling it in here to see what you think. We all have a book in us. I mean, when you come across people who are like, right, Helen, I've come to you because I want to write a book. And we'll say it from the start, it's mainly coaches, but the conversation we're going to have applies to anyone who has this hankering like I do. Do they go, I've always wanted to write it? Or are they like, oh... I've just had a thought. How does it work? Or is it all sorts?

SPEAKER_01: 2:34

Yeah, short answer is all of the above, Kate. So there are absolutely the people in this world who have always wanted to write a book. They're the ones that, you know, and I can probably relate to this, when they were little, they read lots and they wrote little stories and that sort of, that dream never left them, but they never did anything with it for whatever reason. And then you get the other group of people that have had life experiences, business experiences, something they've learned that they want to share and quite often somebody will say to them you should write a book about that and that sort of plants the seed and then once that seed is there whether it's come from early in your life or later in your life it tends to germinate and to grow and that's when people start to talk to me about writing their books.

SPEAKER_00: 3:27

I love that. And I think our episode is very timely because obviously we're coming out in August. And it really is, whether you're working, whether you're on the beach, it's a good time for a stock take. And I think so often us midlife Gen X women, we're so used to, like you just said, that, oh, I've always meant to do this. Or, oh, we put our ideas and our hopes and our dreams on the back burner, don't we, for so long. So now is a good time to dust it off, bring it out, ask questions. Is it because we think we should, and you know how I feel about shoulds, write a book? Or is it something that we really want to do? And if it is and we're ready to go for it, I'm delighted that later on you're going to be sharing your top tips of how we actually get started and make it happen. But firstly, you alluded just now to obviously writing a book has been in your blood from childhood. A young age. So can we delve a bit into your story? See what I did then. Take us back through the chapters because you are, as I said in your introduction, author, but there are quite a few books and such a diversity. Please talk us through.

SPEAKER_01: 4:40

Absolutely. Like I say, I was one of the kids that would stay up with the light on under the duvet to read books when you were supposed to go to sleep. I'm sure a lot of people listening can resonate to that. And so I loved writing when I was little and I wrote all the way into my early 20s. And I originally started writing fiction and I absolutely loved it. But of course, at the time, writing wasn't considered to be a career per se. And you might get lucky like you and go into journalism, but for sort of fiction, it was something that wasn't on the career syllabus, you know, when you were at school. And so gradually, as I got into my early 20s, I got a proper, in inverted commas, job and sort of put the writing... away in a cupboard

SPEAKER_00: 5:33

put away the idle things or whatever the phrase is yeah

SPEAKER_01: 5:36

absolutely yeah we you know we start adulting don't we and we get responsibilities and bills to pay and so on and so forth and the dream kind of gets pushed aside but it was always there and then around 2017 I was um in corporate running big global transformation programs had a really exciting job it was you know met loads of really interesting people um But what I realised was that if I was awake, I was at work. And it wasn't what I saw the next season of my life being. And that dream of writing had never gone away. So I sort of had a bit of a rethink and thought, well, actually, I like what I do. I just want to do a little bit less of it and free up a bit of time to do something creative and just see if I can. And I had no aspirations of publishing at that stage. I just wanted to learn how to write long form. So I did a course. I got a job that was closer to home and was UK centric. And I freed up about 10 hours a week to pursue this writing idea. And I published my first short story and I got paid£1.74p for it. And I thought, this is brilliant. I know, right? Exciting times. And I eventually wrote what would become my first book. So that was a fiction title, a mystery under a pen name. And I thought, this is brilliant. I've got a job I really enjoy. I love writing fiction. I can do this for the rest of my life. And then there was a pandemic. And I was one of the people that I know some people talk about the time at home, giving them space to be creative. But the opposite was true for me. It completely took my creativity and I found that the new way of working as we were coming out of the other side just didn't work for me. I did what I think a lot of people did at the time, which was start to reevaluate my life as a whole. And obviously being in midlife, you do that anyway. So there was a sort of perfect storm of circumstances. And that's when I retrained to be a coach to help people who were similar to me, who were in this sort of different season of their life, looking for empowerment, looking for career change, looking for what was going to be next for them. And I launched a private practice. 18 months ago to do just that to help people and this is where the portfolio career thing came about because a lot of people I found were looking to do more than one thing they wanted to still have a senior job but do it three days a week so that they could do their side hustle the other day a week or you know whatever that might look like and As anyone will tell you, and you'll know this as someone that set up their own business, it's quite a lot of work setting up your own business.

SPEAKER_00: 8:44

It's all the little bits that you think, oh my goodness. And you're not in a position to get an assistant. And it's just like all this... And that takes the time. It does. And you've got to learn how to do it all. And it saps as well. It can really sap you, because especially if you're very menopausal at the same time, the last thing you want to be doing is faffing around with all the nitty gritty bits. But if you don't... Then it doesn't get done. No. Absolutely. And that can lead you to think, I've made a terrible decision here. This is not for me.

SPEAKER_01: 9:16

Yeah. And I think any new business owner goes through that experience and... But for me, there was a key point where I was looking at how I was living my life and I was saying, look, I've made this change because I want this different type of life, but actually I've stopped writing. And that was the very reason that I made my first career change nearly a decade ago in order to pursue writing. And I, you know, coaches are very much around aligning with your purpose. And I think that's really important. And we'll talk about why that's important in writing too later on, I'm sure. And I sort of basically sat myself down and was like, what are you doing? You are talking to your clients about being aligned with their purpose and you are not doing the thing that you have always wanted to do. Like, stop it. Yes, have a word. Yeah, exactly. Literally had a word with myself.

UNKNOWN: 10:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 10:09

And and so I flip my business model on its head and I put written content at its core. So I then wrote a book about how to use your phone less. So completely different. It's a really short guide. And it was something that was coming up in conversation a lot. You know, we live in this digitally overstimulated world that is stopping us doing a lot of the things that we want to do. And so I was like, right, how can I do something short and sharp? It's going to get me back in the creative space, but it's also going to help people. and i got that book out there and when i pressed publish i felt amazing i was like yes this is back this is authenticity in the

SPEAKER_00: 10:48

real was it a different feeling from the murder mystery book or just like yes i'm as you said i've brought myself back out of the mire i'm here again yeah

SPEAKER_01: 10:59

it was i think it was definitely out of the mire and now i am Now, I still love fiction and I still write fiction, but nonfiction is quicker for me to write. I think it's just, I don't know why. I suppose

SPEAKER_00: 11:15

you haven't got all the plot twists and characterisation.

SPEAKER_01: 11:18

Yeah. And I think also you have to relearn how to write stories when you're an adult because you stop doing it. But when you work in corporate, you never stop writing stories. reports and presentations and content and all of the rest of it. So maybe I think there's something in the muscle there. And so, yeah, while I was doing all of that, I was building a network of coaches and, you know, coaches of wonderful, wonderful people. and so coach right came about to help dispel those myths and so that is a very long story of how

SPEAKER_00: 12:14

we got to where we are no i love it because it's really set the foundation and i think that's so important you know that obviously you know what you're talking about um and you're not here to try and flog your services you're here to actually try and help obviously later on we'll be letting listeners know how they can get in touch with you but I think we'll start going into your tips, because I'd really like to dig quite deep with those. And I know there's going to be quite a myriad of advice and information. And I know, obviously, you work mainly with coaches, but the joy of your expertise, enabling us to share our expertise in print, whether that be audio or, well, we'll talk about this as well, audio or actual books. See, I don't know. I don't know the difference. So many things I want to talk about. But these are tips that, hand on heart will apply whatever your subject matter and whoever you are really won't they

SPEAKER_01: 13:07

absolutely and and ultimately coaches are entrepreneurs and i know a lot of you know business owners have that entrepreneurial spirit so the number one thing i always say to people when they're thinking about writing a book is start with why you want to write it And having that end goal in mind. So I know you and I bonded over our dislike of the shoulds.

SPEAKER_00: 13:32

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01: 13:33

What's calling you to write your book? Is it that you want to write the book of your heart to leave a legacy for your family? And if so, that's absolutely great. Money might not be important to you. And that's fine. You know, there'll be different choices that you make for that. You might be somebody that wants to get on a university course syllabus and again if that's the kind of book that you want to write there's a different process for that you might want the bestseller stamp on Amazon and some people really get called by you know the being able

SPEAKER_00: 14:09

to say it seems like me and obviously quite a few of my friends and contacts have been through that process and it It seems to me, as an outsider, that it's almost quite a mercenary positioning. I mean, I know I'm sidetracking a bit, but it does seem to be... God, they're in so many weird and wonderful categories. Yes. I'm sure there are tactics involved.

SPEAKER_01: 14:35

There are. There are. And so... And again, these are some of the choices that it's worth thinking about to begin with. So a bestseller status is given for a short period of time of sales over a short period of time. So there's various marketing techniques that you can use in order to be able to do that, including just telling all your friends that your book is live and wouldn't it be great if they support you by buying their book. So that is brilliant and will help move you up the ranks. If longer term sales are important to you, like your mum might not be your ideal reader so if she and all her friends buy your book it will tell the algorithm in those systems that those to show you know you get the um autobots

SPEAKER_00: 15:19

show up so to show it to 80 year old women which is my book but we might we might mention later on it's not out yet ladies but uh it's bubbling helen's gonna help me i'm very excited about your book okay but as you say no absolutely right it would the subject matter it might be of interest it's like oh that's a nice book but not So if

SPEAKER_01: 15:41

longer term sales are your focus, then actually targeting certain readers using adverts might be a more appropriate way. So this is why I would say to start with that why, because none of these things are right or wrong. They're just what's right for you and what you're going to go after. And knowing that will help you. you before you even get started so that's tip number one and then oh go on sir you're

SPEAKER_00: 16:05

gonna i was just gonna say before we go on to number two i'd like to loop back a bit to the shoulds because i make it very clear why i don't like that word um and from just a general life perspective, it really is the fact that you can get so caught up on all these things you should be doing when in actual fact, it is literally your fear of judgment, your people pleasing and other people's perceptions and ideas in your head. So it's all about bringing them down to a must. If it's a must, yes, do it. If it's not a must, get rid of it. But I think it's particularly, and this goes back to what I said in the introduction, it's particularly relevant we're talking about books and i'm so glad you brought it up because i don't know if it's just my bubble on social media but it does seem to be that there are a heck of a lot of people out there putting out books and the old bandwagon i really do believe and this is a question that i've been asking myself in the last weeks whatever months as in why as you just said getting our why clear because if we don't get that clear and if we let the shoulds guide us we're going to lose momentum we're going to get sidetracked and if anything we're going to end up feeling appreciated because we're like I had this great idea to write a book and it's all gone to because I started yay I'm going to write a book and okay I know I'm sure you're going to say trying to do it in a bubble is not the best way either but Self-motivation, however many people you've got helping you and supporting you, if you haven't got that motivation to keep going and actually go, yeah, this is worth writing, I've got something worth saying, even as you say, if it's a short book, it doesn't matter. It's the message that matters. But I think, yeah, shoulds are so, so important. Don't just do it because everyone else is doing it.

SPEAKER_01: 18:04

100%. And that leads really neatly actually to tip number two. So you've got your why. I like a segue. I know, it's good, isn't it? It's like you've done this before. So your next one is what you're going to write. So again, a lot of people will come to me going, I should write this kind of book because in their head that associates with their measure of success. Whereas actually what I say to people is, what do you read? Because that is what is the best thing. for you to write because you love what you read. So I send people off to their bookshelves or their e-reader and say, Obviously, most of us will read fiction and nonfiction. So let's assume that everybody's going to be writing nonfiction. If you think you should write an academic book, but you only read personal development books, then you might not enjoy writing an academic book. And similarly, the other way around, like if you can't bear self-help, then that's probably not going to be the right area for you. So the thing that I say is, sitting down and writing a book is not something you do on a rainy Sunday afternoon. It's going to take a long stretch of time and you're going to write your book and then you're going to read it again and again and again while you edit it until it's the best that it can possibly be. So you've got to enjoy it. And so, like I say, I send people off to their bookshelves and I say, right, what are the kind of books that... you thoroughly enjoy reading and then what they like like what structure are they what topics are they on what are the themes that pop out to you and kind of that sort of helps people to shape their thinking to take that kind of kernel of an idea and actually then formulate that into some sort of framework that they can put words down so that's that's kind of the next thing is looking at why and then looking at what

SPEAKER_00: 20:02

Because it's the whole tone as well, doesn't it? It will really set the tone of the voice that you use. Because, as you say, if we're not telling a story as such with different characters and either with the narrator or one of the characters is the narrator, it's a different take, isn't it? Yeah. Whether writing in the first person or writing... I'm just trying to think off the top of my head. You don't necessarily have a narrator in... a non-fiction book, do you? So it's... Yeah, but you still have a tone. Yes. Again. Yeah, and with

SPEAKER_01: 20:36

business people... Probably we've already got a body of content. So, you know, if we run our own business, we are likely posting on socials. We are likely writing a newsletter, maybe a blog, maybe articles already. So that tone of voice is probably started to be developed already, which is a big advantage that people that don't have that sort of content generation are used to. And it probably sounds like you. So what I normally say is, you know, read something aloud. Does it sound like you sound? And then write your book as you talk. So again, we touched on audio. These days for nonfiction, audio is really popular. And if you are brave enough and to do your own narration for your own book down the line, you if it's your tone of voice in the first place, it's going to be much

SPEAKER_00: 21:34

more. Because for me, that would feel like obviously doing the podcast as well, but that would feel like a natural fit because my style is very much conversational because I speak from experience. I speak from the women sharing the stories from the women I've coached as well. But it is very conversational. It's not dictatorial. It's not shoulds. This is what's happening now. And I know I've come up with an actual step-by-step plan to help the lovely ladies and men if they want to read it. Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 22:07

I love the sound of your book, Kate. Tell everyone else a bit more about it.

SPEAKER_00: 22:10

Well, I've actually, it's a development because this time last year I did have a free, and it is still a thing, but I've withdrawn it for now because I'm turning it into a proper book, a free, it was 46 pages, which I thought for a free e-book was quite juicy and chunky actually. Yeah. It's called, for now, you may well say, Kate, that's a rubbish title. It is called Your Empty Nest Epiphany, A Beginner's Guide to Bird Launching. And it's aimed at all those mums out there who, well, were at any point in their journey, really. But obviously, at the moment, they've done the exams. Chances are they're off. september october time not necessarily to university they might be going off to a job they might be joining the armed forces they might be emigrating oh my god um and it really is i've put together this plan p-l-a-n i won't spell it out now but it really is to help come to terms with this huge life shift and it is and it hurts and it's difficult and not many people like to talk about it or they talk about it for the first like couple of weeks And then it's like, oh, well, they've gone now. Sandra's all right. Gillian's okay. And we're not necessarily. And there are so many women I've spoken to that will be part of the book as well, which I'm delighted about, who felt alone. They felt that no one wanted to listen to them. And that just makes it worse in so many things, not just empty nesting. So, yes, it's going to be Your Empty Nest, P-L-A-N. And it's also going to have lots of little kind of self-helpy journaling ideas as well that come into it. Yeah, that's the idea anyway.

SPEAKER_01: 24:04

I think it sounds awesome. And I love when we spoke about it before, how you talk about how the idea came to you. Then you put the framework together. Then you've kind of turned it into a short guide. Now you're thinking, oh, actually, there's probably more I can add to that and to make it into a book.

SPEAKER_00: 24:19

It literally is. And we said about life journeys. It was born when my son first went to university. I was in the early stages of stopping drinking. which was a huge life change in itself, I'd been living vicariously through him. Even though I was coaching, still, I adore you, Finlay, but everything, it was Finlay-focused. I'd lost sight of me. I really had. And I was felled by him going. He only went to Birmingham. And then it was COVID. And if I'd known when we dropped him off that first day, God, I'm getting emotional. I'm getting emotional still. I can hear him. If I'd known then that it was going to be 10 weeks before I saw him, you'd have had to scrape me off the car park. But we just didn't know then because his flat... Anyway. And then he came home again in his third year for his year in industry. He worked at Disney for a year in marketing. Loved it. And then he went back again for his final year. And the woman who waved him off as he went into his year four... was a completely different woman to the woman who'd been in that car park in blubbing tears when he started. And I want to share that because it's, I'm digressing into me now, but it is, I'm going to start blubbing. I think there's a lot of conversations to be had around it. And I think it's one of those subjects because, oh yes. And some people find it easy. Every relationship is different, isn't it? Not every mum and their kid get on or, you know, it's a different relationship. It's a different, that's one of my main things, like everything, like writing your book. It's going to be, we'll get back to book. It's going to be a different experience to everyone, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01: 26:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 26:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 26:12

And this is directly related to books because the next thing I would say is know who is going to read your book. So for you, you've had this transformational experience and, And I know how passionate you are about helping people through that challenging midlife phase. So correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it probably was fair to say that your purpose is around helping somebody that's like you were and this feeling, similar things to how you were, but maybe can't afford to come to coaching, maybe isn't quite ready to come to coaching, but just needs someone to hold their hand out to them and say, look, I've been there, I can help you, like, you'll be okay. That's a really powerful why, and you know who, and you know what, and that is really relevant to any business owner that's writing their book, to give them the structure of what they want to

SPEAKER_00: 27:04

do. Oh, that's cool, dear. Because, I mean, again, that's the reason why I launched Midlife Because the conversations to my mind, it's lovely seeing all these wonderful women, big names, getting big numbers, having fabulous guests. But I wanted to bring it back down to us and me and women like me and who was equally fabulous just because we're not a household name and nothing against the household name ones. But to have the real conversations, again, everyone's like, why are they talking about that? But then they actually listen and go, oh yeah, oh, I can relate to that. Oh God, yeah, no, I was feeling like that the other day and I didn't know what to do. I had a glass of wine or whatever it is. It's all about keeping it real. Yeah, for sure, 100%. So the actual nuts and bolts then. We've got our why, we've got our who, we've got our structure. Is it all about... Actually write some words. Yeah. How do we... And also, I'd love to know more. I mean, I know there's so much we could talk about now, but can we touch on the actual whole publishing thing? Because you said, oh, you know, you mentioned before, oh, your short story was published and then your mystery novel was published. How? Because when we were chatting before, and I do like a pre-chat, I had this image of... publishing, going around, cap in hand to all these big publishers going, please, please. They go, no, go away, no. And then I go, I'm going to publish it myself. Yay. And then this kind of pamphlet with a picture of me on the front going, yay. Am I oversimplifying it?

SPEAKER_01: 28:51

It is like a little bit like a curtain, isn't it? People sort of peek behind and go, how do I actually get my book into the world? And there are so

SPEAKER_00: 28:58

many people

SPEAKER_01: 28:58

go,

SPEAKER_00: 28:59

oh, we'll do it for you. Yay. And you're like,

SPEAKER_01: 29:01

yeah. And there are lots of nuances with this, but really broad brush. You've got three options. You've got traditional publishing, which is what we always imagine. So these are your big recognisable publishing names that we'll all be familiar with. And normally with those ways you would put together some sort of pitch and then you would either pitch directly or you would pitch via an agent and that is to your image of like going and saying this is my idea do you think it's good do you want to buy it million dollars yeah hate to burst your bubble cape but you probably wouldn't get a million dollars and there are choices to make there are commercially too so you know some publishers will pay an advice Some publishers will pay a portion of royalties once their investment has earned out. And those sort of commercial things vary depending on the organisation, the size, the idea, the market you bring with you and so on and so forth. Then you've got what we call partnership publishing or hybrid publishing. And those are sort of done for you services. So they have teams where they will, you still have to write the book yourself, obviously, but they'll have like an editing team. They'll have formatters, they'll have cover designers, and they will produce the book for you and put it on all the major platforms. With those, there are some really, really great partnership publishing options. And then there are some not so ethical ones. So you really need to do your research. And there's a cost associated with that. So if you're the kind of person that would rather spend the money and get someone else to do it for you, that's a really good option. And then the third option is the one that I use, which is independent publishing. So I come from a change management background, so organising a team of professionals to support me in my project of delivering my book just made logical sense to me. I wanted to have the control and I also wanted to be able to release more quickly. So now I'm working on my fifth book. I have an editor that I use regularly that, you know, I worked with a few previously, but she's the one that I've kind of really gelled with. I've got a cover designer that I've used before. I do my own formatting. And then I publish directly on YouTube. amazon and some of the other larger digital platforms and then i use a distributor to publish to some of the others so it does mean you have to do the work yourself but it also means i get to keep all the royalties myself

SPEAKER_00: 31:41

so i'm guessing within that kind of network as well you've got the people that help you physically publish the the actual books with pages and stuff like that

SPEAKER_01: 31:51

yeah so um Everybody's familiar with Amazon, so let's talk about the way that they do it. They have a platform where you upload your file and then you can get a proof copy so that you can see what your paperback or hardback looks like. Oh, you can actually do it that way? Yeah, so you order one and you can see what it looks like and you check that, like, there's no weird page

SPEAKER_00: 32:10

spacing. Because I've seen, like, people, like, reels on social media people could have in the envelope and then go, oh, it's the author's copy. So that is literally, I mean, it may not necessarily,

SPEAKER_01: 32:22

but,

SPEAKER_00: 32:22

oh.

SPEAKER_01: 32:23

Yeah, yeah. So that's what you do. You check it. You make sure that there's no random titles on page two. This is beginning to feel quite real now. And then when somebody buys it, it's print on demand. So you don't have to have a box of them in your loft.

SPEAKER_00: 32:36

I was going to say you don't have to have a garage because our garage, I've cleared it out once and my other half has very kindly filled it up again with goodness knows what. I tried to get in there the other day to get the ironing board. It was not happening. Sounds fun. Oh, that's good. I imagine mine getting like little mice eating corners.

SPEAKER_01: 32:57

Yeah. So, I mean, with these days we print on demand, it's so quick. So if somebody, you know, has a next day delivery of a paperback book that you've got on the platform, then they can, they'll print it and they'll send it directly out.

SPEAKER_00: 33:10

Oh, that's so exciting. Now, something else has just sprung to mind when we were talking about writing and I want to put you on the spot a bit. So if you don't want to talk about it, say fine and I'll edit it out. How do you feel about this whole get AI to write all these books for you?

SPEAKER_01: 33:28

Very important question. Definitely don't edit it out. So my second biggest bugbear after the shoulds is I will get AI to do it for me, as this phrase. So when it comes to writing, AI is a fabulous tool for lots of different reasons. But actually, for me, the writing bit is the fun bit. That's, you know, let's loop back. Like the purpose of me wanting to write books is to share story in some way, shape or form that's going to entertain and help people. So I'm not going to give that away. If I was going to give it away, I'd give it away to a ghostwriter, a human ghostwriter, not an AI ghostwriter. However, AI is brilliant at helping with research. So I'm working on a book on resilience at the moment and being able to kind of trawl the internet for examples of things that would be interesting to then go into more detail about. To spark ideas for you as well, isn't it? Absolutely. It's been phenomenal and has given me more unusual things that I might not have come up with otherwise. Super helpful from the editing perspective. So again, because I'm an independent author, I'm very comfortable putting my manuscript in the tool and going, this is my book. Is there anything obvious that I've missed? Does it, you know, I need a summary of what the five key messages in this chapter that I've written.

SPEAKER_00: 34:57

Yeah. So structure and that kind of, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 34:59

Oh, so much easier with an AI assistant. Obviously citations are then checked by me and by my human editor. So again, you can see how it's in the process, not the process.

SPEAKER_00: 35:10

You're using it as a tool rather than... But I think it probably loops back, and sorry if I've interrupted your train of thought there, but it loops back to the why, isn't it? And obviously the stuff that's being pumped out about write an AI book, get AI to write a book for you, it all boils down to these people are money spinning. All they want to do is, and especially it's like they're putting out books that they've got no interest in the subject matter. They know nothing about the subject matter. They're just using AI as a fact accumulator. And to me, it kind of, Yeah, if it makes you millions, good luck to you. But to me, it smacks of a different kind of authorship than we're talking about.

SPEAKER_01: 35:51

Yeah, absolutely. And I sort of harken back to when when eBooks first came out. Remember when we first got the Kindle and there were loads of really, really rubbish books available for Kindle, weren't there? And they called it the tsunami of crap at the time where you just had these people that were like, I'm just gonna write something and I'm gonna put it on the internet and I'm not gonna get it professionally edited and I'm not gonna get a professional cover and I'm just gonna like splurt out whatever I think and then I'm gonna put it on the internet. And almost with AI, we're at that same inflection point where, of course, you can generate a load of words in AI and copy and paste them and chuck them onto a platform. Of course you can. But as a reader, I don't want to read that stuff. So I'm going to opt out. I want to read Kate's book that's got heart and will make me feel something and that I can connect to you as a writer as much as the book. And I suppose that's another top tip is when you're writing a book and marketing a book you're also marketing you writing and marketing that book so it's not just a soulless faceless thing on a digital platform or in a bookshop it's it's you and your brand and so thinking about how those things connect too so there are hundreds of thousands of books available people buy from people that they know

SPEAKER_00: 37:14

like and trust you know we all know that I'm absolutely with you because it does literally set apart, isn't it? Just having that. And people go, oh, AI is going to be taking over the world, all creative careers. That's the end of it. You don't need to have a human being anymore. But I argue every time, like you just said, it's the heart, it's the soul and AI, fabulous as it is for so many things. it can't replicate that until the day that the robots actually take over the planet. Which is why we say

SPEAKER_01: 37:46

please in our prompts.

SPEAKER_00: 37:48

Yeah. Oh yeah. Always. Thank you. Thank you very much. I always, I mean, I don't use it very much, but I know, yes, I've learned that one. Thank you. That's great. But could you just tweak it a little

SPEAKER_01: 38:03

bit? And there are opportunities too, right? So when we talk about audio and, if we think about if you're going to get an actor to produce an audiobook for you you're probably talking hundreds maybe thousands of pounds per final hour of content so it's it's not a cheap thing to do so it's been price prohibitive for a lot of people for a lot of time now there are ai um narrators available that can do that for much cheaper so you can do that. Now, the thing to be mindful of is to tell people that you've done that obviously and say, right, here's the AI version that you can have for whatever price. And here is the human-narrated version that comes with a premium price. Because actually, as a consumer, we probably still want both. Like, I go to the cinema and expect it to be cheaper than when I go to the theatre. So it's, you know, how do we see the differentiation and being mindful

SPEAKER_00: 39:00

of that? Because I'm not a fan at all. I mean, the AI voice is just great with me. I don't know what it is. I don't know what it is, whether it's the intonation, if that's the right word. Just something. I'm like... If I come downstairs and my other half's watching YouTube or something and I'm like, oh my goodness, that voice is just driving. I couldn't, how do you listen to it? And he's like, isn't it? I'm like, no, that's, I'm sure that's not a real voice. There's just something about it. And these are the choices we make when we write

SPEAKER_01: 39:31

our books.

SPEAKER_00: 39:31

But it is all about choices, isn't it? It's about choices. And I'm really excited that later on we're going to be directing, obviously, listeners to the show notes where all your contact details are and on the Midlife Unlimited podcast website. But you have got something rather exciting coming up that we're going to be talking about as well. So all you listeners who would like to get some Helen, and I may well be seeing you there as well. I'm literally, the minute I... press end on this. I'm going to get right. You won't see me. It'd be like, where's Kate gone? Oh, she's, she's in her little shed. Typing away. Yeah. How do you, how do you, do you, do you disappear for hours on a stream of consciousness or do you say, right, I'm going to write for an hour a day or how does it work? Both. Um,

SPEAKER_01: 40:23

it's one of those things where, um, So building the habit to write, I think, is a really useful thing to do if you've never had to do it before. You mentioned the muscle as well. And it really is something that you need to. Yeah. So if you're somebody that likes a bit of habit stacking, then sack your writing next to something like first thing in the morning, make your coffee right for half an hour. You know, if that's a way that you can fit it into your day, then do that. I do know some people that like big chunks of time. So they'll like take themselves off for a weekend somewhere and just literally like heads down and write. For me, I like to do sort of sprints. So an hour, hour and a half, four or five times a week. But similarly, sometimes you'll have a conversation like this and you'll be like, oh my gosh, I've just got like, I just need to sit down and write. So I think the main thing is recognizing that you do have time is, again, I suppose this is another top tip really. Most of us have time that we lose to the scroll hole or to random binge watching. And whilst those things are fun, Those things probably you can probably take a little bit of time back from if you're reading a book on it, don't we? Yeah, absolutely. So it's just kind of carving out those bits of time to get words on a page. And it's a little bit like going to the gym is easier once you're there. just open the manuscripts, like open your laptop, open your document, however you're writing or your notebook and just open it and you'll find you'll get into flow a lot more than you would have expected to. And

SPEAKER_00: 42:05

I will, before we go into your three questions, one phrase as well that I will mention, and I'm sure it's something you come up, not necessarily you yourself, but people talk about writer's block. And I know obviously as a journalist, well, anyone, whether it's writing on social media content, it is a real thing. now i am very much of the school of thought that if you're faced with that blinking cursor and i don't mean blinking i mean literally it's blinking at you just start writing something that's what works for me and i find if i just start even if it's a load of old poo if i just start writing something and uh Carrie, who obviously was a previous guest novelist, she was like, kind of, again, or even write the same word again and again. I mean, not in the shining way, but just to get. Because I think if you go, that's it, I'm done, and walk away. It's like with anything you walk away from, it's the coming back that makes it, it's like that, will you get back on that bike? Whereas I think if you say, right, I'm bigger than this, I'm going to beat this block. I mean, would you agree with any of that?

SPEAKER_01: 43:20

Yeah, I think you can't edit a blank page and you will edit your book. And so one of the things when you're writing your first book is you almost worry that all the sentences have to be to the same standard as the books that you're reading, whereas actually giving yourself permission to just write as it comes. So does it matter if it's rubbish? Does it matter? So if the sentence structure is all over the place, doesn't matter if you spelled all the words incorrectly, there are tools that will help you with that. Like just get it out of your head and down and know that you can come back and you can change it later is a really empowering thing to do. Again, regardless of whatever kind of book you're writing, be it fiction, nonfiction, whatever. And then. Like you say, just keep going. So I know there are some famous writers that would say like they'd finish halfway through a sentence on each session. So it's like kind of like, yeah. Which, you know, try that. If that works for you, then

SPEAKER_00: 44:23

do that. I know my brain would then, even if I walked away, my brain would be subconsciously like...

SPEAKER_01: 44:30

Yeah.

UNKNOWN: 44:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 44:32

Because I like a brain dump as well. I think, like you just said, get it all out there. It doesn't matter if it's, it's all the right words, just not necessarily in the right order. So, and you might think, oh, that sentence would work really well there later on, but it's there. It's all there.

SPEAKER_01: 44:45

And like your book's got these four kind of main categories in this model. So maybe you were starting to write in a kind of linear way and then you get stuck halfway through P and you think, oh, but I've got something to say about A. So I'm just going to leave P for a bit and I'm going to write on A and I'll come back to it.

SPEAKER_00: 45:03

Absolutely. I do that. Or you think actually, no, that would sit better. Yeah. Yeah. I'm so excited. I really am. And thank you for that. Well, we will be giving details of how listeners can get in touch with you in a minute. But we're going to take some time out. Well, no, there is books involved in my three questions as well. If you're ready, we're actually going to move into the three questions that I ask each of my fabulous female guests. And you have been absolutely fabulous. So I thank you for that. And the first question is going to be. What is your midlife anthem? The piece of music or sound that lights you up.

SPEAKER_01: 45:47

So my midlife anthem is the 80s power ballad, Nothing's Gonna Stop Us Now from Starship.

SPEAKER_00: 45:56

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 45:57

Which is... is definitely a dance around the living room kind of a song. They just don't make songs like that anymore, do they? We need the big hair to go with it, though. Oh, I know. Get the hairspray out. And it's one of those things where you go... Is it Mannequin it was from? It's Mannequin. It is from the film

SPEAKER_00: 46:16

Mannequin. My sister loved that. I always found it a little bit spooky and slightly

SPEAKER_01: 46:21

strange. It's very strange. But the reason I love the film is that it... So it was absolutely slated by critics when it came out.

SPEAKER_00: 46:31

Was it? I just remember my sister watching it on repeat.

SPEAKER_01: 46:34

Yeah, and it has become one of those classic kind of 80s films. But actually, the guy that wrote it, wrote it to hit all the watcher expectations. So it's got time travel kind of supernatural rom-com vibes. It's got the montage scenes in it. It's got the anthems that, you know, the soundtrack. It's got all the visuals and the clothes. and actually as somebody that looks when what happens when you start writing books is you start noticing these things in film so I didn't notice this in the 80s but now you kind of go oh my gosh this was written for watchers so again I kind of like the fact that it does that

SPEAKER_00: 47:20

yes groundbreaking that is oh oh I'm learning so much today I'm quite excited right well based on that then Question two, what is your midlife mantra, the phrase that sums up how you live your midlife?

SPEAKER_01: 47:40

So this sort of loops back to the story I was telling earlier about setting up a business and kind of doing lots of things that you feel like you should be doing. So my mantra these days is do something today for tomorrow and do something today that makes you happy now. Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 47:58

And

SPEAKER_01: 47:59

the reason for that is I think we can either get caught up in doing things that we think we need to do for future us, or we get so caught up in the now that we don't do any preparing for the future. And actually, I think to live that truly balanced life, you need a little bit of both. So that's my constant reminder to keep that balance in check.

SPEAKER_00: 48:21

I like that. Oh, yeah. I'm going to do a bit more of that, I think. I'm going to make the most of August and be doing that Yes. Like

SPEAKER_01: 48:30

it's sunny today, right? So go and spend an hour with a book in the garden at some point today.

SPEAKER_00: 48:34

Yeah. Oh, I was first thing out the door. You couldn't hold me back. It was like seven o'clock. I'm like, right, that's it. I feel a walk. I'd planned so many. I was like, turn off brain mindfulness. Come on, bring it back to now. I'm like, go between the two.

SPEAKER_01: 48:54

Oh, but don't you do all your best thinking when you're walking? I do. There you go. Another thing for writer's block. If you get writer's

SPEAKER_00: 48:59

yeah no absolutely yeah that is a good that is a good a good time to not we're not walking away we're saying right you i've you're not you're not beating me mr blinking cursor i'm gonna go and get these gray cells

SPEAKER_01: 49:16

subconsciousness just needs to do its thing doesn't it sometimes just got to give it a bit of space Or maybe a bit of chocolate. Yeah. I can eat chocolate and walk at the same time.

SPEAKER_00: 49:25

Yeah, dark chocolate's really good for you, isn't it? Anyway, enough of this. We now want to know what the title of your autobiography is going to be. A little drumroll, please. Oh, and this is

SPEAKER_01: 49:36

hilarious. This is going to be such a letdown. So, of course, when you... When you publish a book, you have to think about things like SEO. So you will have all of the messaging in your book and you want to make sure that people can find it on the stores. Until I finished my books, I never know what they're going to be called. So they're always the phone book, the career book, the resilience book, whatever, whatever. So I am pretty confident that my autobiography would be called the autobiography for the whole time that I was writing it.

SPEAKER_00: 50:11

It does what it says on the cover, doesn't it? That's the thing. I think there is a danger, and I'm sure you're going to be covering this in copyright, a coach write, not copyright. God, well, that's something else as well to talk about, which we're going to mention in a minute. trying to be too clever when it comes to titles yeah

SPEAKER_01: 50:29

so i even had a quick look at like the top selling autobiographies of the year and there seems to be themes so quite a lot of them have words around kind of hope curiosity overcoming those types of things yeah Some of them are sort of like, I wish I could. And so I did, you know, these sorts of secrets I never told you type books. So there's definitely going to be some themes in there. But yeah, I'm just going to call it the autobiography until it's done. I like that. We'll let it emerge.

SPEAKER_00: 51:03

I look forward to reading that. Now, this is the moment that listeners probably have been waiting for rather than me rambling on about chocolate and mindful walking. How can listeners get in touch with you? And what have you got starting next month, September?

SPEAKER_01: 51:17

Absolutely. So the easiest place for people to find me is my website, which is Helen O'Neill coaching.com. And that is O'Neill O-N-E-I-2-L. And everything kind of loops out from there. So there's all my one to one services for career coaching and my coach right program. And the details are there. So if you are a coach looking to write your first book, we have our next program launching on the 11th of September. to help you do just that. There's also links to all my books on there if you want to have a little look. So there's four on there at the moment so you can look out to your retailer of choice. And I'm really happy to connect on LinkedIn. So I'm Helen O'Neill on LinkedIn if people prefer that way around.

SPEAKER_00: 52:05

Am I right in thinking that you've got a podcast coming? I do, yes. I can't forget that.

SPEAKER_01: 52:12

Very exciting. I know, there's all the things. So as part of Coach Right, we also have the Coach Right podcast, which I think launches on the 20th of August. So I think it's just after this comes out. Yeah, yeah. Where I'll be interviewing all sorts of professional coaches from all sorts of different backgrounds who have published all sorts of different books in all sorts of different ways. So we'll be going into the detail of how they write, what they write, how they publish so that you can get inspiration and learn how to do it too.

SPEAKER_00: 52:42

That's another reason I need to do my book then so I can come on your podcast.

SPEAKER_01: 52:45

Yeah, obviously.

SPEAKER_00: 52:46

And then we can just have this conversation again the other way around. It would be brilliant. About a year's time or I'm not sure what the time frame will be. Soon as possible, next Tuesday. So listeners, I would love your feedback on today's episode. I have learned so much and Helen, thank you again because you've shared, you've inspired, it's been brilliant. So it'd be fabulous if you left a review or you can email or text me via the link in the show notes and come and join the Midlife Unlimited podcast Facebook group. Helen's in there and the link to that is in the show notes where you'll also find the website link to for the Midlife Unlimited podcast website with links of my exclusive VIP midlife metamorphosis coaching. So thank you for joining me today, Helen. It's been absolutely brilliant. Thank you for listening. I look forward to you tuning in next week because don't forget Midlife Unlimited has a new episode every Thursday available wherever you listen to your podcasts. So here's to being fabulous and flourishing together and to living midlife unlimited. Thanks ever so much, Helen. You've been brilliant. Thanks for having me Kate. Bye.